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Post by stevec on Sept 1, 2014 8:57:44 GMT -6
Ken,
More later, but I'm hungry and so is my son. Your last statement gave me a chuckle thought. The Bible proves thst your god is defective, that's not something to be proud about if you're parading around as a god. I'm imperfect, that's to be expected, but a god???
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Post by ken on Sept 1, 2014 9:27:55 GMT -6
Ken, More later, but I'm hungry and so is my son. Your last statement gave me a chuckle thought. The Bible proves thst your god is defective, that's not something to be proud about if you're parading around as a god. I'm imperfect, that's to be expected, but a god??? The problem with your position has various points: 1) You assume that your morality is the correct one (making you your own god) 2) You assume you know all the details that led up to a decision (which no one does) 3) You assume that you interpreted the Bible correctly in English when it was written in another language within the definitions of that time 4) You assume that you are better than God which you have obviously shown you are not. When you can tell me the depths of the oceans, why there is a hole in the sun and how it stays together and how life started, you might just got off of the starting line But, hey, you are a free-will spiritual agent and are free to make yourself a god. I think I will hold on to the fact that the more I know, the more I realize I am barely beginning. I would prefer to live by grace than by any law that can be created. There is mercy in grace as God so desired it from the beginning. It's His love towards mankind through Jesus Christ, the Messiah. Enjoy your lunch. Two weeks from now we are celebrating our 40th anniversary with a Caribbean Cruise given as a gift. Good eating, i'm sure.
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Post by stevec on Sept 1, 2014 18:55:58 GMT -6
Here's how they came to their decision: 1. The president is male and big man on campus. 2. He brings money into the university 3. The board is composed of hypocrites. A Christian school fired a female teacher a few months ago because she was pregnant and unmarried. Why wasn't she forgiven? It's amazing how this forgiving stuff is unevenly applied in Christian circles. At least I'm not an imperfect god. I'm a normal human, and as such, I'm relatively more perfect than your god. If that was the process, it was indeed wrong. You can be forgiven, but that doesn't necessarily translate into retaining a position of leadership. Certainly the Christian school would be another case in point. As a teacher, she could be forgiven but that doesn't necessarily translate into retaining a position of leadership. I think that within that situation there should also be a road to restoration and full acceptance back into the school system. Even in today's public school system, there are things that teachers do and are forgiven but don't retain their position such as having sex with a student. But in all these cases, as in your case and in my case, all punishment was met in Christ Jesus and God has forgiven us and wants to establish His blood covenant with us as shown throughout the Jewish history which I am sure your wife would agree. Actually, all you have proven is that man is imperfect. Your "holier than thou" position puts you with me and the rest of humanity with the need of a Savior. Again, you fall on the "we don't know the whole story" sword. The facts of the matter are that the Christian men in charge in your evangelical world get away with all sorts nastiness. Chances are that the president was screwing somebody else, so not only was he divorced, he was an adulterer. That's the real definition of irreconcilable differences. Pure hypocrisy. There's a poor pregnant unmarried teacher out there without a job. Did the Christian school board figure out how she was going to feed that child? She didn't screw a student. Jesus, do you have a conscience. She should have gotten an abortion, then she wouldn't have had to count on Christian forgiveness to save her. You need a savior, what am I going to do with one of those?
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Post by ken on Sept 1, 2014 19:27:05 GMT -6
Only because you want to see it that way. If you look carefully, I said that if you are right they are wrong. But I understand your psyche and why you interpreted it that way. As you mentioned, in certain cases, absolutely. It is a shame but a reality. However, we also know that news grabs the juiciest 10% to sell news. I find that in most cases they are dealt with correctly. Apparently you would know better than I. I think with that part quite openly. At this point you are trolling. up to you. As a free-will spiritual agent you can pass on it.
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Post by stevec on Sept 1, 2014 19:36:40 GMT -6
1. You forget, there is no god, and I don't pretend to be one. I admit my morality is man made, what's your point? 2. A pregnant teacher is unemployed, and a divorced college president doesn't even get a slap on the wrist. Those are the hypocritical facts. 3. Spare me, death follows your god in any language, in all times. 4. All I know is that I'm a better human than your god is a god. Do you care to tally up the deaths associated with each one of us, or would you prefer to concede that one.
A) the ocean depths vary. B) there is no hole in the sun C) gravity D) we're working on it and we're getting closer every day.
Three out of four ain't bad, so am I off the starting line.
Grace is man made, btw. What islands are you visiting?
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Post by stevec on Sept 1, 2014 19:57:40 GMT -6
Somebody was adulterous. In your experience, is it more often the husband or the wife?
The most important job a private university president has is fundraising. Once again, money rules in Christian circles. Trolling or not, those are the facts.
Don't blame it on "the news" when your evangelical brethren are the people making the news. Do forgiveness instead of talking about it.
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Post by ken on Sept 3, 2014 18:48:36 GMT -6
And your empirical and verifiable proof is... what? You display all the qualities of being a god. Your morality is the right one, your viewpoints are the correct one, you are complete in yourself, and things like unto these. I believe I have agreed to these facts. There is no death in eternity. Yes, I understand that you are holier. We don't know the depths of the deepest part of the ocean. www.space.com/25829-sun-square-hole-nasa-video.htmlreference site doubtful you might count again Is it?
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Post by ken on Sept 3, 2014 18:53:36 GMT -6
Evidence? 1) I wouldn't know. 2) Love of money has always been the root of all evil. 3) As I said, you were trolling and therefore it became irrelevant. Yes, forgiveness is something you do and it has divine roots. Jesus said "Father forgive them for they know not what they are doing" while he was hanging on the cross. The Father heard and thus forgiveness is available for all, including you and me.
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Post by stevec on Sept 3, 2014 21:08:17 GMT -6
Ken,
I'll keep this science lesson real simple because I've learned that you really don't care.
We don't need to know the depth of every millimeter of the ocean floor, only the areas that are important to us. Some things are irrelevant. Gravity holds everthing together, it's what keeps you attached to the Earth. It's what keeps copious amounts of hydrogen and helium together in a sphere called the Sun. This hole you mentioned is really a "coronal hole", not a hole type hole like you'd find in a donut, but we do know what causes coronal holes nonetheless - gravity, fusion, and electromagnetism working in natural harmony. It's only a matter of time before we figure out the sources of life. After all, just a few hundred years ago all that stuff I mentioned was voodoo. Look how far we've come, so I'm betting we have life figured out within the next hundred years. Where will your god be then?
Now, I know that my knowing this stuff makes me appear like a god, but I'm not really a god. I am an adult and I can pick my moral values, no god needed. The onus is on you to prove that a god is needed to have moral values. I'm living proof that a god is not needed,
More tomorrow, my tablet is low on power.
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Post by ken on Sept 7, 2014 4:34:25 GMT -6
In that you didn't know about the hole in the sun, I think you are still up for more science lessons. Out of context, it is irrelevant. In context, the fact that we know so little, is very relevant. It dictates that we do not have the absolutes that God has. You are displaying a multitude of the systemic problems of thinking that you are God. 1) You assume that we know everything about science, that gravity is the only factor that holds things together, and that science never corrects itself. It wasn't too long ago that science thought that light traveled at a constant speed and didn't bend. Is what you called "natural harmony" really that natural? Or is it supernatural to have all of these factors (and perhaps more) working together in harmony while every second it produces 1 trillion megaton bombs of energy that caresses our planet. 2) First you said there was no holes. Now you say there are coronal holes. I'm glad that you have increased in knowledge (however little we know today) 3) Voodoo science. That a BB produced all the information that is driving life today. That somehow the existence of chemicals evolved into life. (no empirical and verifiable evidence.) 4) Faith... "I'm betting we have life figured out" Let's get back to the drawing board. In that you pick what moral standards you live by is a god attribute. You are your own god. Hardly. How does one establish that your moral values are correct? Hope you had a good sleep. May God continue to minister grace to you.
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Post by stevec on Sept 7, 2014 6:57:08 GMT -6
Ken,
Evidently your god has changed its mind about sexuality, because good Christians like you have changed their perceptions on homosexuality and SSM. Historically, you've claimed that god works his miracles through people, so there you have it, SSM is coming to a location near you. Your god has spoken. Christianity's continued existence on the wrong side of the love equation will end with the death of our generation. In which case Christianity will have found a way to harmonize gayness with god's good design. Once again, god will be redefined by humans, much like the way I've defined myself as a god,(so you claim). You're a dinosaur, Ken, your rule is coming to an end.
Do you own a solar(H-alpha) telescope, Ken? I do, and I could teach a class to you creationists on what I know and have seen on the sun. No voodoo required. (Warning - don't look at the sun with a normal telescope)
Btw, I have heard about and seen coronal holes. What was unusual about the one you mentioned was its square shape, that's what made it newsworthy. You may have read about the more well known term for coronal holes called, "dark spots". In addition to dark spots there are also crevices or cracks which weave their way across the Sun's surface. It's really amazing to see in person through an Ha telescope. My first view through one, I have to admit, was an OMG moment. Keep in my mind that OMG is a generic term for amazing, and in no way was I conjuring up voodoo to account for what I saw. The next day I bought an Ha scope. In summary, coronal holes are old news. I thought you were going to describe dark spots when you mentioned "holes in the sun", in which case you were going to get a science lesson. There are really no holes in the Sun, just cavities and crevices, all caused by convection currents. Limitations in our language - they kill your cause all the time.
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Post by ken on Sept 7, 2014 17:12:52 GMT -6
voodoo theology? However, no matter what sexual sin one has committed (because it is hardly limited to the narrow scope you mentioned), there is forgiveness. Even I needed forgiveness in that area of "missing the mark". That is why Jesus died on the cross. Just reporting from reputable sources. You can take it up with them. Then you need to communicate better as you said, and I quote: "B) there is no hole in the sun".
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Post by stevec on Sept 7, 2014 19:05:09 GMT -6
Ken,
What's voodoo theology? Why did you end the reference with a (?), as if I needed to supply the answer? I've never used the term "voodoo theology". Pretty much all theology is voodoo, now that I think about it.
I expected you to claim that it's possible to look right through the Sun with your hole reference. I was looking forward to donut view. Anyway, I hope you now the difference between a donut hole, a coronal hole, and an A-hole.
This is not a picture I took, but it is a typical low power view from my solar scope. Can you count the coronal holes? Here's a hint - there's more than seven or eight.
edit: sunspots are not considered "coronal holes" , per se, and prominences don't necessarily eject from coronal holes. Let me get back to you on this
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Post by stevec on Sept 7, 2014 20:42:17 GMT -6
I was wrong. It's not possible to see what scientists consider coronal holes in Ha, which is the light spectrum my scope uses. You need an x-ray scope to reveal the cooler, darker, less dense plasma areas that constitute coronal holes. Though sunspots are holes, they are miniscule compared to coronal holes. The dynamics of coronal holes are not well understood, though scientists have made correlations to solar magnetic fields. Coronal holes follow openings in the sun's magnetic field. The dark area in the x-ray image below constitute what is considered coronal holes.
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Post by woodrowli on Sept 7, 2014 21:24:15 GMT -6
I was wrong. It's not possible to see what scientists consider coronal holes in Ha, which is the light spectrum my scope uses. You need an x-ray scope to reveal the cooler, darker, less dense plasma areas that constitute coronal holes. Though sunspots are holes, they are miniscule compared to coronal holes. The dynamics of coronal holes are not well understood, though scientists have made correlations to solar magnetic fields. Coronal holes follow openings in the sun's magnetic field. The dark area in the x-ray image below constitute what is considered coronal holes. Looks like a highly worn ancient gold coin. Quite interesting. You just might rekindle my old passion for astronomy.
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