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Post by woodrowli on Jul 27, 2014 7:20:42 GMT -6
True, as most Prophets were specific for the people they were sent to and not relevant to us. Oh, so they were Rent-A-Prophets. Spit them out and use them up like old u-haul trailers. Does god know what the words dignified and noble mean? It's convenient that you perceive prophets that way, since it fits in naturally with human experience. I don't know what to make of it. I suspect I'm looking for something more godlike, less humanlike - something a little less bloody also, funny even, with a touch of cuteness. Rent-a-prophet is probably closer to being true than what you think. All the Prophets were essentially true "Slaves of God". They did what God had commanded them to do. In other words all Prophets were the means of giving human form to God's word.
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Post by stevec on Jul 27, 2014 7:51:44 GMT -6
What else is new?
As they say, if you want to guarantee failure in the future, repeat the mistakes of the past. I don't believe god is as smart as most everyone believes, since he continues to ignore good advice.
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Post by showmedot on Jul 27, 2014 8:32:07 GMT -6
And, too, religious verification typically is nothing but "works for me." Which is fine, I suppose, as long as you don't insist that your personal truth actually IS an eternal verity that should be everyone's.
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Post by stevec on Jul 27, 2014 8:54:50 GMT -6
Like you've stated many times, it's important to verify. If all your prophets are prone to screwing up god's message through error or deceit, then the pool of prophets from which you can verify god's truth is very poor. Verification becomes more like a lottery based on geography. I know that's not your case, but it is for probably 99+% of the world's population. That's not verification, that's the accidental effect of having sex. God's message is delivered through the meeting of vaginas and penises. I'd like to think it more intellectually and spirituality based, but a geographic map of the world's religions indicates that verification is based on fucking. Sorry for being so crass, but sometimes we prophets need to punch people in the nads to get their attention.....................lol, welcome to the new world of atheist prophecy.
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Post by woodrowli on Jul 27, 2014 17:42:16 GMT -6
What else is new? As they say, if you want to guarantee failure in the future, repeat the mistakes of the past. I don't believe god is as smart as most everyone believes, since he continues to ignore good advice. Here is where Muslims differ from many other religions. We do not expect Allaah(swt) to do what we want. Life is a trial, for the most part we are to use what was given to us, from there search for what we are to do. To those who follow a Western Religion Allaah(swt) seems to be indifferent and uncaring. We see it as being "tough love" no free ride. Sort of like the "Survival Show" that is currently on TV. We been dropped of in this island called earth. We have all we need to survive this excursion, but we darn better figure out how to use what was given to us. The journey is up to us, the only thing we know for certain is the means to get off this place is within our grasp. It is up to us to find it and use it properly.
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Post by woodrowli on Jul 27, 2014 18:03:41 GMT -6
Like you've stated many times, it's important to verify. If all your prophets are prone to screwing up god's message through error or deceit, then the pool of prophets from which you can verify god's truth is very poor. Verification becomes more like a lottery based on geography. I know that's not your case, but it is for probably 99+% of the world's population. That's not verification, that's the accidental effect of having sex. God's message is delivered through the meeting of vaginas and penises. I'd like to think it more intellectually and spirituality based, but a geographic map of the world's religions indicates that verification is based on fucking. Sorry for being so crass, but sometimes we prophets need to punch people in the nads to get their attention.....................lol, welcome to the new world of atheist prophecy. You always been this shy, when trying to say what you mean? Just my simple view. While there have been many Prophet's there has been just one message. The message given to all Prophets has been the same. Just variations in terminology and local events to make it understandable to the local audience. Now how to nail down who has the "Message" Start comparing what each alleged Prophet says. As one goes along they should discover a preponderance of statements that indicate what the message is. I believe the message is: There is only one God Heaven, Hell and the physical universe exist Those who do their best to worship the one God will eventually reach Heaven. From there it is simply a matter of fine-tuning and trying to improve what we choose to do or not do.
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Post by woodrowli on Jul 27, 2014 18:09:18 GMT -6
And, too, religious verification typically is nothing but "works for me." Which is fine, I suppose, as long as you don't insist that your personal truth actually IS an eternal verity that should be everyone's. True. In my case I think that is what I believe about everything. If I can catch Trout using a kernel of corn for bait, I will continue doing so, as it "works for me" Not my concern if the guy fishing next to me is using salmon eggs for bait.
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Post by showmedot on Jul 27, 2014 18:22:47 GMT -6
Except that I think it matters whether or not what people believe is real. So far, evidence for the existence of anybody's gods is remarkably lacking.
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Post by stevec on Jul 27, 2014 21:13:40 GMT -6
What else is new? As they say, if you want to guarantee failure in the future, repeat the mistakes of the past. I don't believe god is as smart as most everyone believes, since he continues to ignore good advice. Here is where Muslims differ from many other religions. We do not expect Allaah(swt) to do what we want. Life is a trial, for the most part we are to use what was given to us, from there search for what we are to do. To those who follow a Western Religion Allaah(swt) seems to be indifferent and uncaring. We see it as being "tough love" no free ride. Sort of like the "Survival Show" that is currently on TV. We been dropped of in this island called earth. We have all we need to survive this excursion, but we darn better figure out how to use what was given to us. The journey is up to us, the only thing we know for certain is the means to get off this place is within our grasp. It is up to us to find it and use it properly. That's exactly the reality of life on this planet without god. It's rather convenient to have your spirituality mimic my reality and call it a godly. That's easy to do because, after all, what else do we have? If getting off this place means physically leaving, I'll leave that to future generations, but if you're talking about spiritually leaving, then god needs to pop his head out in this reality occasionally and say hello, and I don't mean through loser prophets, btw. What does god know about survival anyway, it's not like he had to worry about such things. God is a wimp for not having to deal with death. He should be ashamed, no wonder why he hides behind prophets.
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Post by stevec on Jul 27, 2014 21:24:24 GMT -6
Woodrowli,
What's the point of god saying, "there's only one god"?
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Post by stevec on Jul 27, 2014 21:50:31 GMT -6
Except that I think it matters whether or not what people believe is real. So far, evidence for the existence of anybody's gods is remarkably lacking. lol, the only energy expended on this spiritual relationship has been by humans. Considering god's limitless power, it would appear to be a bit one sided, don't you think? I would suggest that we humans stop praying until balance is restored, but energy conservation is not a worldwide concern at this point.
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Post by woodrowli on Jul 28, 2014 19:57:32 GMT -6
Here is where Muslims differ from many other religions. We do not expect Allaah(swt) to do what we want. Life is a trial, for the most part we are to use what was given to us, from there search for what we are to do. To those who follow a Western Religion Allaah(swt) seems to be indifferent and uncaring. We see it as being "tough love" no free ride. Sort of like the "Survival Show" that is currently on TV. We been dropped of in this island called earth. We have all we need to survive this excursion, but we darn better figure out how to use what was given to us. The journey is up to us, the only thing we know for certain is the means to get off this place is within our grasp. It is up to us to find it and use it properly. That's exactly the reality of life on this planet without god. It's rather convenient to have your spirituality mimic my reality and call it a godly. That's easy to do because, after all, what else do we have? If getting off this place means physically leaving, I'll leave that to future generations, but if you're talking about spiritually leaving, then god needs to pop his head out in this reality occasionally and say hello, and I don't mean through loser prophets, btw. What does god know about survival anyway, it's not like he had to worry about such things. God is a wimp for not having to deal with death. He should be ashamed, no wonder why he hides behind prophets. To a large extent we live as if God(swt) does not exist. We are not here for pleasure or even comfort. We are here to learn. This physical stage of our life is simply an embryonic time. But our choices will determine our development
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Post by woodrowli on Jul 28, 2014 20:08:31 GMT -6
Woodrowli, What's the point of god saying, "there's only one god"? Mostly just a reminder we all worship the same one.
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Post by stevec on Jul 29, 2014 10:29:12 GMT -6
To a large extent we live as if God(swt) does not exist. That's a walk in tne park for me. I don't know about that, it seems most everyone attempts to acquire pleasure, comfort, and learning in somewhat equal amounts. Even praying to god serves pleasure and comfort needs, most expecially when both are lacking in one's life. There's nothing especially noble related to learning about/praying to god. It's simply another earthly pleasure. A wise man once said, "Ere you succumb to shocks of mortal pain, The rosy grape-juice from your wine-cup drain. You are not gold, that, hidden in the earth, Your friends should care to dig you up again! "
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Post by stevec on Jul 29, 2014 10:33:21 GMT -6
Woodrowli, What's the point of god saying, "there's only one god"? Mostly just a reminder we all worship the same one. Some of us do, and some don't, and a few of us don't see the need.
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