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Post by Flitzerbiest on Jan 8, 2014 21:55:42 GMT -6
I stand corrected. Somehow that one flew under my radar. The CDC and NIH, by the way, are fantastic examples of government doing efficiently what the private sector does not or can not. I concur that the CDC and NIH are necessary governmental agencies to keep an oversight on private businesses. That's not what they do at all, but it's a nice sentiment.
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Post by Flitzerbiest on Jan 8, 2014 22:00:56 GMT -6
I would say that I'm curious why you posted this in the first place, but to be curious implies a degree of uncertainty about the answer. Vaccine denial is, for whatever reason, a common Evangelical blood sport. A few of reasons: 1) First you are in the medical profession and I thought you would be interested in it 2) Second - just thinking about this family, can't imagine the pain and suffering they must be going through. 3) Third - to add to the topics of discussions. 4) Last - it is interesting to see the broad reactions to a simply statement of "This must be very difficult for the family."Incidentally, I vaccinated my children The Evangelical anti-vaccination fad only started about 10 years ago. You vaccinated your kids long before it took off. Have you spoken from the pulpit or the lectern about vaccination in the last five years?
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 6:44:22 GMT -6
A few of reasons: 1) First you are in the medical profession and I thought you would be interested in it 2) Second - just thinking about this family, can't imagine the pain and suffering they must be going through. 3) Third - to add to the topics of discussions. 4) Last - it is interesting to see the broad reactions to a simply statement of "This must be very difficult for the family."Incidentally, I vaccinated my children Spare us, you have a history that you can't hide from. You vaccinated your children before your evangelical mentors took up the anti-vaccination cause. I seriously suspect you wouldn't have them vaccinated today as a new parent. all this from a simple "This must be very difficult for the family." Apparently Jesus really bothers you. My children vaccinated their children. (I received Jesus before the youngest was born)
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Post by stevec on Jan 9, 2014 10:19:05 GMT -6
Spare us, you have a history that you can't hide from. You vacinated your children before your evangelical mentors took up the anti-vaccination cause. I seriously suspect you wouldn't have them vaccinated today as a new parent. all this from a simple "This must be very difficult for the family." Apparently Jesus really bothers you. My children vaccinated their children. (I received Jesus before the it oungest was born) If anyone else had started this thread, I would have simply expressed my regrets and posted the two sites that confirmed the results. You are in the habit of embracing the evangelical mindset that prayer cures all, no vaccines neccessary. As it has been pointed out, this antivaccination movement was started within the last 10 years, long after your children would have been exposed to that mindset. The fact that your grandchildren were vaccinated says more about your children than it does about you. Answer a simple question - If your children were born today, would you allow them to be vaccinated?
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 10:45:52 GMT -6
all this from a simple "This must be very difficult for the family." Apparently Jesus really bothers you. My children vaccinated their children. (I received Jesus before the it oungest was born) If anyone else had started this thread, I would have simply expressed my regrets and posted the two sites that confirmed the results. You are in the habit of embracing the evangelical mindset that prayer cures all, no vaccines neccessary. If you can find one quote where I supported a "no vaccines necessary"--fine... if not, you are putting words into my mouth. Please note... my grandchildren are 2 @ 10 years, 2 @ 8 years, 2 @ 6 years, 1 @ 5, 1 @ 4 1) Your pre-supposed position is wrong 2) It shows bias I think it shows both. It shows how I raised them. Yes... except for the Hepatitis vaccine (at this time). So... what do I have from one simple statement of "This must be very difficult for the family." from you. 1) shut down religion 2) put words in my mouth 3) make statements that are unsupported and factually wrong 4) No discussion but rather an attempt to have a punching match. You are adding value to this site for sure.
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 10:53:23 GMT -6
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 10:59:06 GMT -6
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 11:04:52 GMT -6
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Post by stevec on Jan 9, 2014 11:20:11 GMT -6
Good, glad we could clear that up.
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 12:08:59 GMT -6
Good, glad we could clear that up. Happy to help
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Post by Flitzerbiest on Jan 9, 2014 13:00:26 GMT -6
Ken,
No one has argued that the anti-vaccine movement is limited to Evangelicalism. The point is that it has taken root in Evangelical churches in a big way.
Now, please answer the direct question that I posed, if you dare:
Have you in the past five years spoken from the pulpit or the lectern about vaccination, and if so, have your comments the sort that might be taken as doubt casting on the safety of vaccination?
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Post by ken on Jan 9, 2014 13:39:43 GMT -6
Ken, No one has argued that the anti-vaccine movement is limited to Evangelicalism. The point is that it has taken root in Evangelical churches in a big way. Now, please answer the direct question that I posed, if you dare: Have you in the past five years spoken from the pulpit or the lectern about vaccination, and if so, have your comments the sort that might be taken as doubt casting on the safety of vaccination? I just point out that it has taken root in more that just one sector of the US. Who knows, maybe even some atheists are part of the NorthWest anti-vaccination group. Even your statement has the hue of "It's the evangelicals that are at fault". May I also point out that I doubt that the percentage of "evangelicals" that are anti-vaccinations would reach a double digit. (just an opinion based on my area--not once have I heard any pastor promote a non-vaccination policy) There are, however, holistic naturalists who do (both evangelical as well as non-evangelicals) If I dare? Are we back to childhood days of double-dares? As if a dare would change what I do? Try the last 30 years of my teaching the word of God. Never once have I talked about vaccinations. And we make sure that people know that if you go to the doctor, it is perfectly all right.
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Post by stevec on Jan 9, 2014 13:40:08 GMT -6
I'd like to clarify one more point.
Has your church invited anyone to speak about vaccines to members of the congregation?
Edit - just read your last post. Question answered.
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Post by Flitzerbiest on Jan 10, 2014 18:13:33 GMT -6
Ken, No one has argued that the anti-vaccine movement is limited to Evangelicalism. The point is that it has taken root in Evangelical churches in a big way. Now, please answer the direct question that I posed, if you dare: Have you in the past five years spoken from the pulpit or the lectern about vaccination, and if so, have your comments the sort that might be taken as doubt casting on the safety of vaccination? Never once have I talked about vaccinations. Good enough for me. Thanks for answering clearly and directly.
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Post by ken on Jan 10, 2014 19:24:33 GMT -6
Never once have I talked about vaccinations. Good enough for me. Thanks for answering clearly and directly. No problem Fltiz. it was a fair question.
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